Fermented ginger turning pink

Hi Kirsten,

I hope you are well.

I am writing regarding your fermented ginger recipe. I made a batch with young ginger and put them into separate jars, they are 1 week old and overnight one of the jars changedcolour to a pinky hue. Please see attached photos.

Do you know why this might be? Also is it safe to eat? It doesn’t smell bad.

I absolutely love your books by the way!

Thank you for your help,

Best,

Anne-Marie

Hello Anne-Marie,

Nice to hear from you. Remember lacto-ferments are safe to eat if the pH is 4.0 or below and if they smell fine. Check the pH with test strips.

The color looks fine, I have seen this variation before. When in doubt always test pH and trust smell and over all texture, etc. Usually things that are bad will let you know by being quite off—like smelling rotten.

And if the pH is not low enough you know that there could be things that are not right.

Cheers,

Kirsten

There is no brine on the surface of my ferment

Hi

The fermentation is on 4 weeks ago. I noticing there is not water on the surface is it normal ? If not what can I do to fix it?

Thanks

—————————————

Hi there,

Looks good to me, brine doesn’t always stay on the top. It is normal for brine to appear to "disappear." It isn't actually going anywhere but it isn’t hanging out on top anymore making everything thing feel comfortable and secure.

What is happening is that as the ferment gets active the CO2 creates all the little spaces for it to sink back down into the vegetables. It looks like this ferment is fine. It does however appear to have a little surface yeast on top which is harmless. This is called kahm yeast and is harmless. You should skim off as it doesn’t taste good. It also looks ready and I would put in a smaller jar and and be sure to press it down. Then store in the fridge.

Also don't forget it is the acidification that makes your ferments safe as soon as they are sour they are usually well below the 4.6 pH safe point which means that the microbes that are harmful can no longer live in. Any yeast and mold will be where there is oxygen and can be skimmed off.

Enjoy,

Kirsten

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Black on jar ring from fermentation

Hello
Two weeks in on my fermented peppers
The fermentation as stopped and I am seeing black mold ?
In lids.
What went wrong?☹️
Thanks 
Mark

***********************

Hi Mark,

I don’t think that is black mold in your lid I think it is the reaction in the metal from the acid and salt. You certainly don’t want to eat that but it is common and doesn’t harm your ferment. 

Wash the lid off and you can even put a piece of parchment paper between the lid and the jar so this can’t happen. 

Cheers, 

Kirsten

*********************

Hi Kirsten,
Thanks for the quick response.
One more question.
I have been burping for two weeks. But there is no off gassing(fizz) when I open jars as there had been.
This and the black stuff is what made me think my ferments had been compromised.
This is only my second batch to ferment. 
First batch I only fermented 10 days and still was off gassing when I made my hot sauce.
So I don’t have much perspective on the normal process.
Thanks so much for your help.
Mark

*********************

Hey Mark,

Good news! Off-gassing stops when the fermentation slows down, it means there is less sugar for the bacteria to be eating. All normal and part of the process!

Hope they are tasty,

Kirsten

Are My Antique Crocks Okay to Use for Fermentation?

Hi Kirsten,

Just bought the book fermented vegetables.  Love it so far.  I haven’t started fermenting yet.  I want to keep reading and gather some start up supplies.

As I am beginning to look for crocks I am concerned about which ones may have lead and what sizes are best to use.  I have found a 2, 3, 8, and 12 gallon.  I did not purchase any of them because I don’t know if they have lead.

Attached are some pictures.  Do you know if there are certain companies that used lead in their ceramic glaze?  If it’s high fired do I need to be concerned?

Please help,

Jenny

******************

HI Jenny,

Thank you, I am delighted to hear you are enjoying the book. 

Let’s see. It is hard to say on the older crocks without doing a little test. You can find a lead paint test kit in a hardware store. Then you have to try it in a place the glaze is damaged, or scratch so of it on the bottom. I don’t know much about how the firing would make a difference though I imagine it might. It is my understanding though that one should avoid all with lead. The older crocks are certainly much cooler, but I can’t speak  to who did and didn’t use lead. 

None of the new crocks have lead. I would say, if you can test them before you buy then that is your best bet. 

I hope that helps. 

All the best,

Kirsten

Is this mold or yeast on top of my pickles?

Hello,
I used fresh washed cucumbers, grape leaves, dill fronds, and garlic all from my garden, plus peppercorns submerged in a brine consisting of 8 cups of water to 5 tbsp sea salt. I used a pickle pipe on the lid.
Started ferment on Aug 26, picture is on Aug 29.

Thanks, Tracy

***************

Hi Tracy,

Definitely mold. Skim the top to remove mold. Wipe down edges with a clean towel. You can even remove leaves and replace with new ones. Then add new brine to the top and refrigerate. This should solve it. And the leaves have helped keep your cucumbers unaffected. It might seem like a short ferment but they will keep fermenting slowly in the fridge!

Cheers,

Kirsten

I want to understand pickle mold

Hello, I have been fermenting for many years and I always wonder about the whole mold. I have heard some say just scrape it off and you'll be fine. I wondered your opinion. Hear is a pic of my odd pickle mold.

Thanks for your help.

Kelly

***************

Hi Kelly,

There are different kinds of mold and with those different concerns. The smaller white molds are okay and can be scraped off — once you get into pink and black molds you should throw it away. I also find that if it is a shredded sauerkraut scraping off mold will get you to a layer that has been anaerobic and safe from the mold, however, like in your pickles below that mold is on a cucumber that goes through the whole jar and I consider this to be more infected.

I hope that helps,

Kirsten

---

Others have had mold on their pickles, be they cucumbers or other vegetables in a brine. Here are some other troubleshooting articles that you might want to check out as well:

• Deborah opens her pickles after two weeks of fermenting and is greeted by Fuzzy Mold! Deborah asks about types of mold that can be scraped off and those that lead to throwing out the batch.

• Charles is concerned no so much with the top of his ferment like Debroah but the bottom and sediment that has formed at the bottom of his fermented peppers.

• Ted wants to know what’s up with the different colors of his lacto fermented pickles. Kirsten responds with a description of the various phases of fermentation with pickles and the resulting coloring.

Fermented Tomatoes with white "mold"

I have two fermenting quart jars going on right now. One has habanero peppers and garlic, while the other has tomatoes, carrots and squash in it. They both have air locks on them. My question is, the one with tomatoes is getting like a white mold at the top and when the jar is tilted the white "mold?" is seen in the head space.
Is this normal or is this bad? Why only the one with vegetables. The first photo the jar is tilted on the second photo under comments to jar is level. Your opinions PLEASE.....

****************

The good news is this is not mold. It is s kahm yeast and harmless. I would leave it alone until you are ready to put your ferment in the fridge. At that point spoon it off as best as you can and put the ferment in a new jar with as little air-space as possible—this should solve it. As far as why, well it happens and tomatoes and other sugar-filled vegetables are prone to it. Nothing you did.

Are Fermented Vegetables Cooked?

Hi Kirsten,

Just found out about your business through OPB, and then saw your recipe for Carrot-Lime salad. I’m wondering if the fermenting process cooks the vegetables slightly or at all? I’m allergic to raw carrots, raw celery, and other very random raw foods, but can eat them all if they’ve been cooked (even a minute or two in a microwave eliminates this allergic enzyme or whatever it is…!) (Discovered a few years ago through my friend google, that this actually has a name: Oral Allergy Syndrome…) Up to this point I've just avoided any raw carrots, or fermented carrots, not wanting to deal with the itchy throat. Reading about your experience with fermentation, I was curious if you know anything about this (cooked vs. raw once fermented)? Thinking it might be like ceviche - acids cook the raw fish to create a finished dish of lime, fish, veggies…

Thanks for any thoughts you might have about this!

Jana

*************************

Dear Jana,

Wow there is a lot to learn here. I’ve spent most of the day looking through research papers and trying to get my arms around this. I’m guessing you are allergic to either birch or mugwort pollen, depending on what some of those other raw fruits and vegetables are. Either way as you probably learned from your friend Google the proteins in both of those veggies that are triggering your body’s allergic reaction are denatured by heat and likely also by your gastric juices. The question you raised, does lactic acid fermentation do the same thing, doesn’t appear to have been studied, at least I have yet to find it. The acidity in fermented carrots probably just approaches the pH 1.5-3.2 of our stomach, I’m not sure if there is a minimal pH level needed to foster enzymatic activity on the protein. In fact there seems to be a debate in the research in terms of what the pH likely is From what I can tell the thermal treatment unfolds the proteins, which causes them to not bind with the antibody response. The proteins I think at play here are PR-10 Bet v 1 proteins. The most promising thing I found is from a paper in Molecular Immunology 100 from last year that states “In addition, there are also numerous non-thermal processing methods such as e.g. hydrolysis, fermentation, UV-exposure and radiation influencing protein stability.” It later mentions Lactobacilli as having the capability to reduce IgE binding capacity.

So with all of that I think your hunch might be right. Would I would suggest is to ferment the carrots fully, meaning for a pint you might want to let them at least 3 weeks or maybe a month at room temperature. They will probably be a little soft but we would know that the lactic acid bacteria have had plenty of time to break things down, hopefully including the proteins that are fooling your body into thinking they are pollen and need to be dealt with in your mouth.

Our bodies are amazing aren’t they? Thank you so much for the question that I will continue to puzzle over. Please let us know if you decide to experiment and what the outcomes are. I do hope it works and you can once again enjoy carrots, celery and other veggies fermented.

Let me know if you have any questions about any of this and I can clarify or send you research I have found.

Cheers,

Christopher

Fizzy Fermented Vegetables

Hi there,

I was wondering if you can help with a question I have. I have lacto fermented cucumbers once and I think the ferment went well however the pickles were so fizzy I couldn't eat them. This has also happened to me when I bought some fermented pickles from a shop. Again, I couldn't stomach the fizzyness. I am on day 3 of a batch of lacto fermented cucumbers and all is looking well with bubbles present but I just dont like the extreme fizzyness.

I have done some research but have found some conflicting information. Firstly, is the fizzyness safe? Secondly, is there any way to stop this from happening? Will there be a stage where the fizzyness settles down?

Thanks so much!

Jessica

•••••••••••••••••••

Hi Jessica,

I am assuming the fizziness is dissolved carbon dioxide in the brine, which were likely created by bacteria and maybe yeasts. In either case the fizziness is likely safe, though its making the pickles unpalatable for you which isn’t so good. I looked at some research on CO2 and brined cucumbers and they found that the amount of salt and the cucumber varieties both affected the amount of CO2 produced. The early CO2 (before the brine turns cloudy after a couple of days) seems to mostly come from the process of the brine saturating the cucumbers. After that it looks like the rest of the CO2 comes from the microbes. The researchers also found that the higher the salt concentration (they measured 4, 5.4 and 7%) the lower the total CO2 produced.

Taking this into account, perhaps you could lower the amount of fizz by either raising the salt in the brine or trying a different variety of pickling cucumber or both.

Christopher

Feremented Rhubard Question

Hi Kirsten,

I made the lacto-fermented rhubarb fool recipe on your website in May with the hopes of preserving it for the winter. It worked well and tasted great. I left it in a half gallon jar in the fridge and recently moved it to the fridge door. When I looked at it again today, I noticed a slimy film on it. It doesn't smell bad, but it looks pretty bad. Do you have any ideas if it is salvageable?

Thanks,

Carolyn

*********************’

Hi Carolyn,

I am happy to report that is just a small bit of surface yeast—called Kahm yeast. It is harmless. It can only grow where it has oxygen.

The best way to resolve this is to skim off the yeast one top and then put the rhubarb into a new smaller container. This will help control any population of yeast that is hanging out in the jar ready to go back to work when you remove it. More importantly a smaller jar will have less head space for oxygen to hang out and should solve the issue.

I hope that helps,

Kirsten

Fermenting Pepper Mash Floating over Brine

Hello Kirsten,

I just got your Fiery Ferments book (Love it!) and am just starting my first fermentation: the basic pepper mash. I started it yesterday and the mash does not seem to want to stay under the brine. I keep pressing it down with a large spoon, but the brine immediately settles at the bottom again. Is this ok? Is there anything I can do to keep the mash submerged? Thank you so much for writing such a wonderful, easy-to-understand book! I’m excited to try more ferments and eventually move on to the tempeh!

Sincerely,

Karen

*************

Hi Karen,

We do love to hear that people are out there using (and loving) our books. Thank you.

Your mash is behaving just as it should, and yes, it is nearly impossible to keep it under the brine. After a lot of different ways to try to solve this issue, I found the best is to leave the lid on tight —looks like yours is. Once (or twice if it is super active) open the lid slightly to burp it (release pressure) and then tighten right back up. Since CO2 is heavier it will push out the oxygen and rest on the top of your mash, shielding it. After you have burped it shake the jar to get the pulp and brine mixed up. It will separate again in a few hours but don’t worry there is no oxygen in there to cause it grief.

When it starts to slow down you will find that it will be less active and separate a much slower rate, and eventually not separate at all.

I hope that helps.

All the best,

Kirsten

Black Color on Beet Kvass

Hi Kirsten,

I ran across your page and thought I'd send this to you.

I'm new to fermenting, and decided to try kvass. I used a veggie peeler to get thin slices just as an experiment for texture. I tried this with 2 quart sized Mason jars. One batch turned out amazing. Best way to have beets IMO.

The other batch is why I'm contacting you. I used folded cabbage leaves to hold down the beet floaties. However the top of the cabbage leaf was exposed to air and developed a black mold of some sorts. It spread to the jar lid, the inside of the jar around the top, and looks like it leached down the side and went all the way down to the bottom. Take a look at the pics. Notice the mold I wiped away with a paper towel, and in the other pic how there is a thin black line streaking down the inside of the glass.

Is my batch contaminated??

I'm not comfortable getting sick over $2 worth of beets, so I'm cool with throwing it out and starting over. Just curious what it is and if it's harmful.

Lesson learned, put a rock in a baggie that keeps the cabbage submerged.

Thanks,

Kyle

************

HI Kyle,

Nice to hear from you. Glad you are starting to ferment. I might be missing something that I can’t see in the photos but it looks to be that the black that you are seeing is actually oxidation which is quite common with beets and often happens near the top of a ferment — where the oxygen is.

I think that is all you have going on which isn’t going to make you sick. Just take off anything discolored. Also luckily with ferments you can’t get sick by something you can’t perceive—in other words bad ferments are pretty disgusting. ;-)

Definitely you are on the right track, keep everything submerged. I think the air-pockets that I see in the ferment would concern me more. Luckily nothing has moved in. Just press them out before storing.

I hope that helps,

Kirsten

Troubleshooting Mold: Leaky Jar lids

Hi Kirsten,

I started making sauerkraut to sell at two farmer’s markets where they have created a terrific small business for me. However I have two major problems.

The first is mould in the jars. After the sauerkraut is decanted into the jars ready for sale, I notice that after a couple of weeks, in the fridge, they often have mould and taste awful. Sometimes if I catch them early I can scrape off the top inches and everything is fine underneath and we eat it ourselves. I can’t weigh the kraut down inside a jar for sale, so I was wondering if you had any tips there.

The second problem is that often people say they love my pickles, all thanks to your recipes, and would I post them down to them? But I can’t because my jars leak! No matter how much I tighten the twist off lids they still leak like mad. Which I don’t mind as it seems to be an outlet for fermenting gasses to escape and not build pressure up in the jar, but the customers don’t like my leaky jars either, especially the poor lady who had a very enthusiastic beet kraut bubble up in the boot of her car and left a big stain! She is not a fan any more... I’ve noticed that the sauerkraut from health food shops that is labelled raw and live do not have leaky jars but I can’t work out what they do to them. If you can cast any light there I would be profoundly grateful.

Thank you so much for launching us on this amazing fermenting journey,

*******************

I am glad to hear of your successes.

I am sorry for your trouble. I had to smile at the story of the beet kraut. We also had some overactive beets when we were in business, people weren’t happy when it made their bags look like a veggie murder scene.

Oxygen is getting in your jars. I suspect your lids aren’t airtight. If they were there is no way that the mold could grow, also this look like surface yeast to me not mold. The ferment covers itself with a layer of CO2 when there is no new oxygen getting in the jar. Since you are having a regular issue and the jars are leaking it tells me that the jar style you are using isn’t working.

When we taught in Chile a few months ago we bought jars that should have worked but they were not airtight and it caused a problem. The lids were a similar style to the one pictured. I would suggest finding a different jar source. When we were in business we used jars made for canning and they had a solid seal, even without the hot water bath. Some jars will only seal when boiled.

I hope that helps!

Kirsten

Blackened Red Onions

Hello,

I attempted fermented red onions for the first time. The top half of them smelled, appear, and tasted great. The bottom half had pieces of red onion that had turned completely black. Very different smell. It was an off putting sour smell. Definitely not the same pleasant smell that was coming from the top portion of the jar. As I got closer to the bottom there was more black pieces and the smell was worse and stronger. Any ideas?

********************

Hi there,

Nice to hear from you.

Somehow some oxygen must have gotten into the bottom of the ferment as it is unusual to see this happen from the bottom and not the top. I can’t say how that happened but it definitely sounds like you got spoilage due to oxygen. I trust you tossed it.

Cheers,

Kirsten

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Submerge in brine conquers evil every time!

At least that was our mantra before the first book was published when in one of the last edits the evil part got reworked but it means the same thing. Anaerobic fermentation is what we want to be successful in this type of fermentation. To achieve anaerobic fermentation we need to keep the air out of the process, or away from our vegetables that are fermenting below the brine line.

This trouble ticket was unique - I don’t think we have gotten an upside-down oxidation situation like this one. It could be that when they filled their jar with red onions they just dropped them in and didn’t smush down, thereby trapping air below. Its a good reminder that for anaerobic fermentation you need to get all of the air expelled from the vegetables below the brine line for the best results.

What Are The White Spots On My Pickles?

Hi Kirsten!

I have a question for you!

Can you tell me why this littles dots on my Pickles is normal? (Pictures are attached) They dont have that before..

The pickles was made the last summer so already 7 months in the fridge. 

Also, I find that often, my fermented vegetables are soft. Not crispy (pickles, greens beans, radish...) why ?

I always put a little bit of black tea in the final jar but help to keep their crispiness.

But I need your help! 

Thanks!!!

*********************

Hi Carolanne,
Oh dear, those do not look well. I believe this is some kind of fungus. This could happen if even one of the tops of the pickles was peeking out of the brine. That little bit of exposure acts as a vector. 
As far as soft ferments, more often than not that is because there is not enough salt in the brine. One of salt’s functions is to harden the pectin in the cell walls and this is what keeps things crispy. Tannins help but you need more salt to begin with. 
Cucumbers are especially needy in this regard. Of all the things I ferment cucumbers get the highest salt ratio. They just want to soften otherwise. You want to you a 5% brine. 
I hope that helps,
Kirsten

Should Fermented Rainbow Chard Turn Brown?

Hi Kirsten,

I recently tried fermenting some rainbow chard stems. They looked and tasted good while they were cementing, but after moving them to the fridge they are starting to turn brown at the tips. They have softened significantly, but don't smell or taste bad. I didn't weigh them down, so some were slightly poking out of the brine. I've attached some pictures. Are these safe to eat? 

Thanks for your help,
Cassidy

**********************

Hi Cassidy,

Unless they are somehow off-putting, smell, taste, mold etc. they are likely fine. If they are soft, that could be off-putting, but are safe if they taste fine. If they are mushy or slimy then they are no longer good.

The color and softness likely came from poking out of the brine. 

Cheers,

Kirsten

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Rainbow chard is beautiful, right down to their stems. Okay, not as much as the leaves, but they are still pretty for a stem and they ferment wonderfully. Unfortunately, a lot of rainbow chard recipes omit the stems, which is too bad because there is flavor to be had and its a great zero-waste option.

flavor hint

Stems in the pickling jar will take on the flavors of the brine spices that you use so this is your chance to be creative. Just take your favorite pickling spice mix and create a brine. If you don’t have a favorite brine, or you haven’t done this before think about checking out a copy of our first book, Fermented Vegetables. You can get copies everywhere, or if you want a signed-to-you or someone as a gift just order one from us.

A personal online course for you

If you want to make these types of stem ferments, or you found this page because you have tried a ferment and its not what you had hoped think about taking a course from us. Here are a couple that you might consider checking out. Also, when you register with the school for free you can drop in and view any of the free preview lessons of any of the instructors’ classes to get a feel for them and what you will be learniing.

What Causes Blue Mold to Grow on Fermented Pickles in the Fridge?

Hi.

Thanks for your website. I’ve fermented for over 10 years and until last year had delicious pickles. Last year the pickles in my old crock did not taste good, although the texture, firmness and looks were good. This year all four batches were delicious after they’d fermented on the counter., both green beans and cucumbers. I refrigerated them and they were good for a month. Then after being away for a month I found a blue mold on the surface of brine - on all 4 batches in the refrigerator. Same as that batch last year. They looked great, were firm but the taste is like medicine, like mold, after I'd carefully removed the mold. They are not good to eat. The mold is more leather-like than scum. I don’t think they are dangerous to eat, but sure not pleasant to eat. I’m tossing them. What went wrong? Should I invest in the German pickling jars? 

*********************

Hi Rebecca,

You are welcome, glad it helps. Goodness do you have some fine mold mats. 

It is good that you tossed them. Somehow you you you have gotten some tenacious little mold spores. The thing is they need oxygen to grow, sometimes when you repack a ferment from a crock there is just enough oxygen in the headspace to allow mold to grow. If the ferment is still a little bit active when you repack it you can actually let it sit out for a day with the lid on tight and as the lid bulges a bit then twist it slightly to burp it. This will push out the oxygen as the CO2 the ferment created is heavier an it will now blanket the pickles to keep them from growing mold.  As far as do you need different equipment? It is possible that there are some spores that have taken up residence in your older crock and they are what is giving you grief. Also older crocks sometimes have lead in the glazes whereas the newer ones don’t, so that might also be a reason for you to replace. With what? is personal preference the water trap crocks with the weights are nice, but you must be sure to keep the water full, otherwise they are just as prone to mold and other oxygen loving microbes as an open crock. Fermenting is jars is also a great option. 

Cheers,

Kirsten

What Color Should Fermented Garlic Have?

Hi! 

My name is Dalton and my fiancé and I have started our journey into the world of fermentation! That being said we started with the simple garlic honey ferment but I’m getting worried about the look the garlic seems to be taking on.

I’ve had some of the honey and I tried a garlic clove about 6 days ago and both were very good. But the farther along it gets the more the color is turning grey/dark and to me it looks strange. Is this ok to eat or does it mean the garlic is going rotten and we should start again?!

Thanks for any advice you can offer!

***********************

Hey Dalton,

Nice to hear from you—welcome to the fermentation journey. It is a good one. 

The color of the garlic will continue to get darker over time and that is perfectly normal. Go ahead and eat and enjoy your honey and your garlic. 

Cheers,

Kirsten

Why Would Fermented Green Tomatoes Appear Slimy?

Not Okay Okay

Hi!

Thanks so much for all your advice and support.  I’m not super new to fermenting, but realize I’ve never done a cut, seedy vegetable before (mostly whole cukes, beets, cabbage etc), and notice something odd on this batch of green tomatoes. Some, but not all, of the cut surfaces seem to be acquiring a whitish, slimy looking (although not slimy feeling) bloom.  They have been under brine, in a crock, for about 3 weeks, and a few seeds have floated to the surface and caught mold, but I’ve discarded these and everything else seems to be fine.  One week ago they smelled and tasted pretty good - thought I’d let them go longer and now they don’t taste as good, and several have this... stuff.  Any thoughts?

Thanks in advance!

********************

Hi Sara,

You are welcome. I am happy to help! However, I am afraid I won’t be much help on this one. It sounds like you did everything just right and last week all was well. Given they don’t feel slimy, just look slimy, I wonder if they just fermented too long and microbes that moved in were not yummy flavor makers. ou also said they don’t taste as good which to me is another indicator that the microbes shifted on you. This off course is all just an educated guess. I can tell you that in general cut seedy veggies are much quicker to cause problems. I have come to doing my cucumbers and green tomatoes whole (or chopped like relish) for this reason.  

As far as this batch, if they are not rotten (sounds like they aren’t) but aren’t pleasing there is not much you can do at this point. If you don’t like them don’t eat them, or make a relish with the ones that are okay and eat it soon. 

I hope that helps.

Cheers,

Kirsten